Yet another turbo question... - Subaru WRX Forum
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#1 Old 08-26-2009, 03:48 PM
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Yet another turbo question...

This is in a similar vein to the '06 turbo upgrade thread below, but more of a low rent variety. I just scored a TurboXS TMIC for fairly cheap to complement my stage 2. There are a ton of used VF39s and not quite so many VF43s floating around out there for $300 and $500 respectively. Another C-note or less for a fuel pump and voila, as much HP as I will probably ever need (yeah right). Well, a protune, of course, but one of those would likely be in the cards anyway. I don't care about making 350 whp, I honestly believe I could be satisfied with 270-280, something like that.

Has anyone who has gone from a TD04 to a VF39 or 43 regretted doing it? Are those crappy and not worth bolting on or are they a worthwhile upgrade? Is it risky enough buying a used one to warrant spending several hundred dollars more on a brand new one?
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#2 Old 08-26-2009, 03:52 PM
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IMO if I had the money I would buy the new one especially with a turbo. You dont know how the person drove the car and how bad a used one might be then your just s**t out of luck on the money you just spent. Like they always say "You get what you pay for" just my 2 cents.

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#3 Old 08-26-2009, 04:57 PM
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Have you looked into the FP68HTA turbo ? Brand new there 800-900 bucks and I've heard nothing but greatness from them. Its the new hybrid turbo. Its suppose to flow like a 18g but spool like a 16g. Anywho, with a conservative tune, 270-280 whp wont be a problem. I think the limit of these turbos is somewhere around 300-310whp and for the price you cant beat it. Just one more option. Good luck.
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#4 Old 08-27-2009, 07:26 AM
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vf39

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmcutter View Post
This is in a similar vein to the '06 turbo upgrade thread below, but more of a low rent variety. I just scored a TurboXS TMIC for fairly cheap to complement my stage 2. There are a ton of used VF39s and not quite so many VF43s floating around out there for $300 and $500 respectively. Another C-note or less for a fuel pump and voila, as much HP as I will probably ever need (yeah right). Well, a protune, of course, but one of those would likely be in the cards anyway. I don't care about making 350 whp, I honestly believe I could be satisfied with 270-280, something like that.

Has anyone who has gone from a TD04 to a VF39 or 43 regretted doing it? Are those crappy and not worth bolting on or are they a worthwhile upgrade? Is it risky enough buying a used one to warrant spending several hundred dollars more on a brand new one?

IMO, you can easily make your goal on a vf39. Spend the couple extra bucks to find one that has low miles on it from a good owner. With supporting mods, my 05sti is expected to make 350ish whp on the stock turbo with no meth. Granted, I have a lot of supporting modifications, but I plan on going bigger in the future. I had an 07wrx that was stage 2 and when I climbed into this car, it was night and day.

a vf39 with catless turbo-back and a stage 2 tune will almost get you to your goal with nothing else. Get a protune with a few extras and you'd be done.


And to answer the other post about the forced performance turbo, just spend the extra couple hundred and get the FP Green. I have a friend who's making 406awhp on an fp green with meth. I have personally driven his car and was AMAZED at how well this turbo spools. If I get an upgrade down the road, I'm already sold on the FP Green. Just my 2 cents. Hope it helps.
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#5 Old 08-27-2009, 06:15 PM
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The VF39 on the 2.5L motor is a decent turbo. Spools fast and has a decent power output. I think that it is a solid upgrade for you.

My name is Ken and I am a HP Junkie.
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#6 Old 08-28-2009, 06:51 AM
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Is there a functional difference between the VF39 and the VF43? I know Cobb has OTS maps for the 39 and the 18G; I want to be able to bolt up the turbo and run an OTS map until I can get the protune done. Would the 39 map work for the 43?
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#7 Old 08-29-2009, 12:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slipknot9mt View Post
IMO, you can easily make your goal on a vf39. Spend the couple extra bucks to find one that has low miles on it from a good owner. With supporting mods, my 05sti is expected to make 350ish whp on the stock turbo with no meth. Granted, I have a lot of supporting modifications, but I plan on going bigger in the future. I had an 07wrx that was stage 2 and when I climbed into this car, it was night and day.

a vf39 with catless turbo-back and a stage 2 tune will almost get you to your goal with nothing else. Get a protune with a few extras and you'd be done.


And to answer the other post about the forced performance turbo, just spend the extra couple hundred and get the FP Green. I have a friend who's making 406awhp on an fp green with meth. I have personally driven his car and was AMAZED at how well this turbo spools. If I get an upgrade down the road, I'm already sold on the FP Green. Just my 2 cents. Hope it helps.
i would say a green is a bit out of the OP's goals. not to mention he would have to upgrade injectors, fuel pump(might wanna do this anyway) and bring greater risk to cracking that #4 ringland.

the advantage of getting a vf39(i've also seen hairline WG cracks on 43's) is that it can easily be replaced, found, and for a rather inexpensive amount, considering the benefits it provides. your stock fuel system would be able to handle such an upgrade. problem is that, yes, a used turbo is always a bit scary to put on your car AND for a a little more money you can purchase the HTA68.

the vf39 is a great turbo to make everyday driving more fun, especially if you are cruising around plenty of twists and turns. a 20g-green is a bit less fun to drive but provides a lot of enjoyment in case the c5 zo6 pulls up next to you. having gone through all these turbos, i opted for something a bit different with a version 8 turbo twin scroll vf37 setup. almost the same size as the 39 but spools much faster, especially with the supporting mods.

to answer your original question, the only regrets i get from people who go from td04 to vf39 is that they wish they had gone bigger. everyone says,ï'll be happy with just the 270-280whp; i don't need anymore than that." until the oragne srt4 with orange wheels, orange hat, and orange shirt blows by them in the middle of a snow storm with his windows down and heater on full blast. of course you should decide what you want to do with your car.

DD = vf39
autoX = vf39
street racer...-hta68 or +
drag = forever 21
road course = any of the above + helmet. they don't sell those at forever 21.

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#8 Old 08-29-2009, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerHouse View Post
i would say a green is a bit out of the OP's goals. not to mention he would have to upgrade injectors, fuel pump(might wanna do this anyway) and bring greater risk to cracking that #4 ringland.

the advantage of getting a vf39(i've also seen hairline WG cracks on 43's) is that it can easily be replaced, found, and for a rather inexpensive amount, considering the benefits it provides. your stock fuel system would be able to handle such an upgrade. problem is that, yes, a used turbo is always a bit scary to put on your car AND for a a little more money you can purchase the HTA68.

the vf39 is a great turbo to make everyday driving more fun, especially if you are cruising around plenty of twists and turns. a 20g-green is a bit less fun to drive but provides a lot of enjoyment in case the c5 zo6 pulls up next to you. having gone through all these turbos, i opted for something a bit different with a version 8 turbo twin scroll vf37 setup. almost the same size as the 39 but spools much faster, especially with the supporting mods.

to answer your original question, the only regrets i get from people who go from td04 to vf39 is that they wish they had gone bigger. everyone says,ï'll be happy with just the 270-280whp; i don't need anymore than that." until the oragne srt4 with orange wheels, orange hat, and orange shirt blows by them in the middle of a snow storm with his windows down and heater on full blast. of course you should decide what you want to do with your car.

DD = vf39
autoX = vf39
street racer...-hta68 or +
drag = forever 21
road course = any of the above + helmet. they don't sell those at forever 21.
I found this analysis to be great, among the best I have seen when answering a turbo upgrade question so far. Your explanation made the differences between the turbos very tangible. My only question is, where do you think an 18g fits in there?
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#9 Old 08-29-2009, 09:48 PM
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I've been emailing back and forth a lot with Clark Turner and he said the best bang for the buck using the stock fuel system (injectors, anyway) was the Evo 3 16G. And after reading Powerhouse's analysis, I have to agree-if I ended up maxed out at 280 whp I would be kicking myself for not having spent a few hundred bucks more for 30 more hp. I'm leaning heavily in that direction now, especially since buying a used turbo is a crapshoot. I've been around long enough to know that there is a reason people say "you get what you pay for".
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#10 Old 08-29-2009, 10:50 PM
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IMHO for a 2.5L you have to go 8cm exhaust side, whether it be a EVO3 16G 8cm or TD05H-18G 8cm. The 2.5L really needs the 8cm exhaust side, many tuners over on NASIOC have actually claimed it spools better than a 7cm on a 2.5L.

Personally, I have a Blouch TD05H-18G 8cm on my 2.5L (EJ257 hybrid build) and I love it. It is great for a Daily Driver, AutoX, and has an awesome powerband.

Also, I would not skimp and use the stock injectors as they tend to max out pretty quickly. Deatschwerks injectors will give you $200 when you trade your stockers in, 750ccs are about $400 (so after the trade in they will be $200).
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#11 Old 08-29-2009, 11:03 PM
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That 16G on the 2.5 will be a nice setup. Not much lag, and a good kick to it. What size injectors are you looking at getting? And have you made a decision on the TMIC yet? Best of luck with your decision man.

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#12 Old 08-30-2009, 01:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S.O.V View Post
I found this analysis to be great, among the best I have seen when answering a turbo upgrade question so far. Your explanation made the differences between the turbos very tangible. My only question is, where do you think an 18g fits in there?
personally, and this is not from personal experience, i would go HTA68 over an 18g. i realize this is not exactly what you are asking for but the HTA68 is essentially an 18g with 16g spool. something i read and also john@cobb swears by. i was really curious about these HTA turbos so i went to cobb and i found out they have tuned a few of these.

in my opinion, the HTA68 is the PERFECT turbo as far as cost, reliability, power, response, performance, and streetability.

cost - it is around $800. very inexpensive considering what it is capable of pulling of. see nasioc's proven power section regarding HTA 68's

reliability - i've had a chance to look at this turbo side by side with my 20g, made from the same company and i can say it is much higher quality than the stuff FP used to make. my visuals aside; because this turbo can make such good power, it is a lot easier to see how far this thing can go on "ones" car and then turn down the power and still be at a satisfactory power level for the street. you can always turn things up for competative racing.

power - again, see nasioc's proven power section regarding HTA 68's. if i remember correctly there were a few people who hve been able to push over 350whp on cobbs mustang dyno. that's great performance.

response - this turbo spools insanely fast for what it is and how much power it can put out. the new HTA technology is something i wish was available for every turbo. unfortunately FP only fits these wheels to a few garrett turbos and their own snails, which is why i am waiting to see if they will ever fit this to something like Tomei's twinscroll 20g with jdm spec c flange which is supposed to be released october or my own vf37 upgraded to an HTA 20g wheel.

performance - check power and reliability

streetability - i'd imagine this turbo would be INSANELY fun to drive around every day. it has the capability to have a nice run through the mountains, a stop at the track, a run with the vette on central blvd, and a moderately decent price to be rebuilt(less than $500 from FP) or replaced completely.

of course this is ALL speculation but i feel that it is accurate in most aspects. if i didn't already have a jdm header, up-pipe, downpipe, and turbo i'd pick this up in a heartbeat and run it on E85 with some good timing. my ideals. hope it helps.

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#13 Old 08-30-2009, 01:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c2bcoolwrx View Post
IMHO for a 2.5L you have to go 8cm exhaust side, whether it be a EVO3 16G 8cm or TD05H-18G 8cm. The 2.5L really needs the 8cm exhaust side, many tuners over on NASIOC have actually claimed it spools better than a 7cm on a 2.5L.

Personally, I have a Blouch TD05H-18G 8cm on my 2.5L (EJ257 hybrid build) and I love it. It is great for a Daily Driver, AutoX, and has an awesome powerband.

Also, I would not skimp and use the stock injectors as they tend to max out pretty quickly. Deatschwerks injectors will give you $200 when you trade your stockers in, 750ccs are about $400 (so after the trade in they will be $200).
upgrading your fuel system is ALWAYS a bonus. it's better to have too much fuel then air i always say. plus with an upgraded fuel system and parts setup it is nice to be able to upgrade/downgrade turbos by simply just replacing the turbo.

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#14 Old 08-30-2009, 09:33 AM
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This is a classic example of what we call "scope creep" in the engineering world. I initially started out thinking about dropping $300 for a used VF39 and $70 for a fuel pump and calling it a day. Then we get the "might as well do this while we're doing that" and it becomes an $800 turbo and injectors...but since I already have the TurboXS tmic inbound, I might as well do it right...

Sounds like the HTA68 is comparable to the Evo 3 costwise and it does look like an impressive performer.
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#15 Old 08-30-2009, 01:37 PM
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it seems that is always the way it works with modifying. there's always a bit more you can do for a bit more and more. i am at a pretty comfortable spot with performance now myself, but i am dreading to have to get in depth with suspension.

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