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FP Red, Green, or GT52? im horrible at making decisions

20K views 44 replies 10 participants last post by  mosc 
#1 ·
so im wanting to save up to get a new turbo and get close to the 400whp mark. seeing how my car will be a daily driven car, lag and crazy top end arent something i really care to much about. wich turbo would be the best one to go with cause i for one have been given thousands upon thousands of routes to go with.
 
#2 ·
out of those three the Green would be the best...but I would go with the FP68HTA...spools almost as fast as stock and can put you in the 380-390awhp range with a fantastic tune
 
#4 ·
I'm almost speechless...^

What are you talking about? Tim Bailey consistently makes those kind of numbers...

I was going to post a link but it looks like those dyno results aren't up anymore, he must be revamping now that he merged with Cobb. Anyway, 375 to 390 was a very consistent result on a green.

And having run an FP green, and now having a 500 hp WRX, I'm gonna have to say Matt knows what he's talking about.
 
#10 ·
68HTAs are hitting 350s on E85 on median reading dynos. Claims of 360 on pump and almost 400 with E85 or meth are ludicrous. Those are numbers being produced by the The Shop in CT's magically unicorn dyno. You're talking about a glorified 18G.

Tim Bailey/Surgeline has been with Cobb for 2 years now.
 
#5 ·
i really really want to hit 400whp on a mustang dyno. i know its not about the number, but for me it kinda is. dont get me wrong i would rather have a reliable tune and be fine with a lower number than go ballz out and risk it just to reach my goal. but all n' all i want to get 400whp while retaining great reliablity. i just havent herd much about the 68hta. its my understanding that i cant reach 400whp without something greater than a 20g
 
#6 ·
I'm sorry I guess I should clarify, yes a green will meet your goal...but you won't hit full boost until after 4200RPM...and while the 68HTA won't hit 400 anyday on a Mustang, I've seen it come close on an STi on both a dynojet and dyno dynamics, so your probably looking at a 360whp turbo on PUMP GAS...now if you do run E85 you'll have an outside chance at 400. But the beauty of the turbo is that you'll hit full boost by 3200-3600 and hold it to ~6500-6700 RPM depending on your supporting mods, even though you won't have the same peak power you'll have more under the curve which is why there are plenty of cars running this turbo in the mid 11's
 
#7 ·
Problem with the green though is that it's a BIG turbo for not being ball bearing. It has horrible transient response. For a drag car it's great, but if you want to auto-x the car it kind of sucks.

HTA68 will get you in the 375 range on E.
GT3076 will get you around the 375-425 mark on E depending on tune, elevation, etc.
My choice would be a Dom 3XTR though. Spool is probably on par with a 3076 and has more power potential to run 450 or more to the wheels.

If you ever want a turbo above the HTA68 size though (roughly), do yourself a favor and at least throw some forged pistons in there.
 
#8 ·
Seriously, you want 400 whp and not do a piston upgrade? Then stop trying to play in the number game. 330-350 whp/tq is the fine line of possible piston popping power. If not at least blowing a ring or a bearing. You still want quick spool and big numbers. Its not going to happen unless someone makes a twin scroll turbo that is capable of both. Problem is that most aftermarket twin scroll doesn't work the way it should be. Asynchronized scroll. That way one compressor gets it scrolling fast and then it switches over to the other compressor to get the big number. Think this is a stupid idea and it can't happen? It can and I can't find a link to it. But, I heard that's how the new dodge turbo diesel does it. After a certain pressure is reached the turbo ends up pushing the second compressor.

Almost all aftermarket twin scroll are synchronized scroll and it doesn't help as much as it should. That's what my tuner was telling me. That and the exhaust system has to be linked up just right to get twin scroll to perform at its best. Headers, manifolds, pipe lengths, UP, and DP everything has to be in tweaked in to get it running at its best. I was secretly wishing that Blouch would end up making a twin scroll Dom 3.0. But supposedly they can't get the housing to make it and its just not a project that my tuner will be able to test for them.

Matt is your turbo sychronized scroll or asynchronized?

In Short Keshav. Get the turbo Matt was talking about, a 20G-XT, or a Dom 2.5 XTR. All of those turbos spool quickly and make a great top end. If your willing to suffer some lag....a slightly bigger turbo like a Dom 3.0 or simular will get the numbers like Chris has said. But, your probably going to blow up the pistons, rings, or bearings.
 
#12 ·
I know this is comparing apples to oranges, but on my first Evo 8 (LOTS of mods) I had a ported fp green that was only putting down around 325whp on 91 octane (DynoDynamics). But it drove like a dream on the street and I'd go that route again in a hearbeat. It's a fantastic DD turbo but trying to hit 400whp with it on an Evo requires E85 at a minimum, and usually meth.

I agree that instead of shooting for 400whp you should aim for 350whp if you don't want your car breaking. If you want the pychology of telling people you have 400whp then you can do it but you're going to have gobs of turbo lag and a less reliable car.
 
#14 ·
well i guess 400whp isnt really the best option then. after reading the comments above, id rather have a turbo that spools quick and pulls hard pretty close to redline than having to wait forever just to spool it up. the tuner at secret services suggested i run n02 rather then meth for safety reasons and that its easier to tune for. so 360-380whp is good enough. big numbers arent really necessary and/or practical for what i use my car for really. if i can hit 11's with the 68hta on 93 and meth/n02 ill be set.

(right now im making 267whp and 299wtq corrected on a mustang dyno while running crazy rich)
 
#18 ·
there arent many E85 pumps around here. theres 1 pump in down town but thats all i know of. i can get 93 no problem. my stock turbo has shaft play and im pretty sure its gona go out sometime soon. this is why im trying to narrow down a turbo that will provide me the best power and reliablity with good spool up.

thing is ive asked around and explained my goals for the car and i get people telling me to get a blouch turbo, an fp turbo, an amr t60r, and a gt3076r, but never give me the full reasons as to why this turbo is better for such and such reason because blah blah blah. apparently the stock sti block cant hold much power, yet some say its all about the tune. i for sure am never gona run a gt35r on the stock block cause thats just stupid. yet i dont wana shell out money for a turbo that is slightly larger than the stock snail just for 20whp. thats a waste of money.

ima just go with kirt and get my self a blouch dom. 2.0xt or 2.5xt, headers, ewg, fmic, 740cc injectors and just call it a day. im tired of being swayed this way or the other, or playing it way to safe. im not saying im gona crank up the boost to 30psi for the sake of power and disregard the communities warnings, but id rather have a hard pulling, fast spooling turbo that will allow me to put more power down in the future if i decided to build my motor out. or will allow me to have enough power at a safe level that will satisfy my goals. forget fp, atp, aps, gt30-71-76r, gt35r, 6262, gt 49-52. ima stick with blouch get a proper tune and be happy knowing i made the right decision. cause in reality i have a brand new car. new engine with less than 10k and a fresh tranny with less than 4k. so i intend to enjoy this beast as long as i can.
 
#20 ·
Ok, agreed. lol

Keshav, you can get vf39's on nasioc for around $300 in great condition. Ya it sucks to buy the same turbo you already have. It sucks more to get a call from your shop and tell you their diagnosis is that you blew a piston. Stick in the 400 crank range or that could easily happen. Just my .02
 
#21 ·
im just gona get it slap it on and do a very conservative tune on it and only go higher if want to. if im able to get pretty freakn close to 370-380 without sacrificing reliability awesome. if not ill settle for 350whp, but ill know that if i ever do decide to build my motor ill know full well that i can push the turbo farther and make even more power.
 
#24 ·
Still want 400 HP? Heres a video (with the parts needed) to make 400HP (on92OCT):<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/XFm8jR8lWc8?fs=1&hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/XFm8jR8lWc8?fs=1&hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>
 
#27 ·
again, your looking for a number...DON'T DO THAT!...decide on where you want your power and then buy parts that will help you achieve that goal...in my case I chose top end hence why I ran a Green...not because of some number, because yes I made 400 on a dyno jet with it, but I took the same car not changed to a mustang and made 340...numbers are just arbitrary
 
#26 ·
Maybe my current list (slowly being purchased) will let you respect 400+ whp. Yes you can bolt a big turbo on about anything and make big power, but that won't last long. Even if you get a big turbo and keep it tame, it'll eventually pop, and they never do that when it's convenient. I would get a used VF39 for now, make that sucker out, you can make 330ish WHP, and damn close to 400tq on those if you run the right fuel. Then save, save, save for a built short block and then upgrade the turbo. By that point you should have all the supporting mods to run the turbo and you'll only really have to do the engine and turbo swap.


Block/Crank--------------------------------------------------------$375.00
Machine Work------------------------------------------------------$250.00
Wiseco Pistons (100mm)/Manley Rods--------------------------$712.50
Main and Rod Bearings - ACL Race Std. Size or HX------------$93.90
OEM Gasket Kit/Case Bolts---------------------------------------$277.50
Subaru OEM 11mm Oil Pump and Extra Shim------------------$118.00
Killer B Optimal Oil Pan & Ultimate Pickup & Baffle-------------$669.00
Group N Engine Mounts-------------------------------------------$131.10
Injectors - 1000cc ID's w/Pigtails--------------------------------$427.50
Walbro 255 lph fuel pump and install kit------------------------$82.65
Turbo Inlet- Perrin/AMR--------------------------------------------------$250.00
KS Tech Big MAF CAI - 73mm-----------------------------------$240.00
Gates Timing Belt/OEM Tensioner/Gates Water Pump---------$273.00
Supertech Dual Coil Springs/Ti Retainers-----------------------$204.25
APR Head Studs/1 Step Colder Spark Plugs--------------------$169.10
Brian Crower Stage II Cams-------------------------------------$586.00
Turbo - Blouch 480xt 10cm^2 Hotside--------------------------$1,650.00
Carbonetic Pro-Blade Clutch/Fly ABS23132-16----------------$1,349.00
Heads - Clean, PnP-----------------------------------------------$500.00
Total Cost----------------------------------------------------$8,268.50

Granted this is more than you truly need, but I want a decent size turbo (i'd prefer something larger than 48 lb/min but that's all I have to pick from now) to make power out past 7500 rpm's so I have all the headwork and cams in there. Regardless that's barely $1,400 out of an $8k+ budget to make what I feel is a safe 400+ WHP engine (turbo limited at this point). Even then, I'm still taking a risk that the 08+ WRX trans is stronger.

I'm buying rods, pistons, rings next week! Score!
 
#31 ·
if you think that's crazy, one of these days I'll post up everything I've done, and I BELIEVE that mine is asynchronous I'll phone full race tomorrow for confirmation, sorry I missed the question in your prior post
 
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