06 Turbo Upgrade - Page 2 - Subaru WRX Forum
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#16 Old 08-17-2009, 03:17 PM
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From your explanations and the assumption that you have 93 octane to work with, I'd say get a TD05-18G and have them P&P it with some of the money you'll save. None of the turbos you are looking at are bad choices though.

...

And I gotta fix some math here again too. If you say X% dyno loss and you want to back calculate flywheel HP, you have to divide by the inverse. If you say 30%, then you'd divide your whp by .7 which is actually like multiplying it by 1.43 NOT 1.3. If you say 25% loss, you'd divide your whp by .75 which is actually like multiplying it by 1.33 not 1.25.

Lets say on our dyno, a stock STi reads 210-220whp (typical mustang low reading). You can find the losses by (bhp-whp)/bhp so that's 80 to 90hp loss out of say a stock 300 or 27-30% loss. If you then have a car that makes 280whp and you want to back calculate, you're going to divide by .7-.73 which comes to 383-400 bhp

For example, if we assume Josh's stock car made 225bhp and dynos in the 170whp range, we find that the dyno has 24% losses. To find his BHP when it dynos 326whp, you'd divide by .76 which gives 429 bhp.

And keep in mind
1) bhp numbers are all bullshit
2) dynos have different losses
3) numbers get distorted by a million little factors like temperature, humidity, altitude, fuel, etc etc etc...

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#17 Old 08-17-2009, 03:40 PM
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Yeah that makes sense. Basically, that logic just narrows down the decision to two, the 18g and the HTA68. Just out of curiosity, with an aggressive tune, could you turn out 280whp on the stock turbo (assuming all supporting mods & 93?)
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#18 Old 08-17-2009, 03:46 PM
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I put down 270 WHP on a Mustang Dyno with my stock VF39. It isn't a really aggressive tune at all.

I don't think that you could do it with a TD04 though.

My name is Ken and I am a HP Junkie.
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#19 Old 08-21-2009, 01:05 AM
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im also thinkin about puting the HTA68 in my 06 with supporting mods. not to expensive puts down enough power to keep me happy for quite a while. not alot of lag. with injectors fuel pump and a larger IC id be down with engine stuff.

by the way...whats a legit TMIC thats best bang for the buck that would work well with the HTA68? sorry for thread jack
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#20 Old 08-21-2009, 09:40 AM
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Just get a big one like the APS or Perrin units.

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#21 Old 08-21-2009, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by srninjastar View Post
im also thinkin about puting the HTA68 in my 06 with supporting mods. not to expensive puts down enough power to keep me happy for quite a while. not alot of lag. with injectors fuel pump and a larger IC id be down with engine stuff.

by the way...whats a legit TMIC thats best bang for the buck that would work well with the HTA68? sorry for thread jack
HTA68 is a good turbo, however I still prefer an 18G (for a 2.5L at least). The HTA68 uses a TD05 Compressor Housing and 7cm exhaust side, which are not ideally suited to your 2.5L/EJ255 and is much better suited to the 2.0L/EJ205. A Blouch TD05H-18G 8cm for example uses the larger TD06 Compressor housing and 8cm exhaust side, this makes the the turbo better suited to the 2.5L and less likely to creep. However, I have not heard any reports of the HTA68 creeping and it is just my opinion that the smallish TD05 housing and 7cm are going to choke it a bit. I really wish FP would at least offer an 8cm option.

Also, there has been some good numbers put up with the HTA68. But, most of those numbers/dyno charts that I have seen are at higher boost levels (21PSI+), using E85, and/or on a Dynojet. My 18G 8m (for example) puts down 320whp (dynojet) on 93 pump gas at only 16PSI (2.5L/EJ257 hybrid setup). I do not think a HTA68 will get 320whp at 16PSI on pump gas.

As for good TMICs: Spearco, Perrin, APS. NASIOC (check the classifieds/for sale section) usually has one for sale for about $300 or so...no reason to spend $700 on a new one.
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#22 Old 08-21-2009, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by c2bcoolwrx View Post
HTA68 is a good turbo, however I still prefer an 18G (for a 2.5L at least). The HTA68 uses a TD05 Compressor Housing and 7cm exhaust side, which are not ideally suited to your 2.5L/EJ255 and is much better suited to the 2.0L/EJ205. A Blouch TD05H-18G 8cm for example uses the larger TD06 Compressor housing and 8cm exhaust side, this makes the the turbo better suited to the 2.5L and less likely to creep. However, I have not heard any reports of the HTA68 creeping and it is just my opinion that the smallish TD05 housing and 7cm are going to choke it a bit. I really wish FP would at least offer an 8cm option.

Also, there has been some good numbers put up with the HTA68. But, most of those numbers/dyno charts that I have seen are at higher boost levels (21PSI+), using E85, and/or on a Dynojet. My 18G 8m (for example) puts down 320whp (dynojet) on 93 pump gas at only 16PSI (2.5L/EJ257 hybrid setup). I do not think a HTA68 will get 320whp at 16PSI on pump gas.

As for good TMICs: Spearco, Perrin, APS. NASIOC (check the classifieds/for sale section) usually has one for sale for about $300 or so...no reason to spend $700 on a new one.
From what I've gathered thus far, granted still in the research phase, the 18g will produce more top end power and produce more at higher PSI levels (larger turbo). However, though the HTA68 and TD05's (16g's) in general may be better suited toward the 2.0L engine, the HTA68 still offers a good comprimise between a 16g and an 18g offering less lag than an 18g but more top end/output than a typical 16g. Moreover, I personally am not trying to put 350whp down, more like 280-300whp. The HTA68 should be able to get me there realtively easily (with supporting mods) and still leave room to grow through a more aggressive tune, which is why I find it more appealing than the 18g.

As far as top mounts go, I was looking at the TurboXS, they are thicker than any other TMIC i've looked at and not more than an inch shorter by any other measurement. I've heard thicker is better as far as TMIC go, and you can get the TurboXS cheaper than APS or Perrin.
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#23 Old 08-21-2009, 02:04 PM
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I run a TurboXS on my setup. Bolted right up with no issues. Mine came with all the hoses and clamps needed. It seems to handle my 20G just fine, just the stock air splitter is no useless with such a big TMIC.

Joshua
"2007 WRX- PPG'd, 20G- Tim Bailey tuned
Stage 2 2005 WRX
Cobbtuning.com"
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#24 Old 08-21-2009, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by S.O.V View Post
From what I've gathered thus far, granted still in the research phase, the 18g will produce more top end power and produce more at higher PSI levels (larger turbo). However, though the HTA68 and TD05's (16g's) in general may be better suited toward the 2.0L engine, the HTA68 still offers a good comprimise between a 16g and an 18g offering less lag than an 18g but more top end/output than a typical 16g. Moreover, I personally am not trying to put 350whp down, more like 280-300whp. The HTA68 should be able to get me there realtively easily (with supporting mods) and still leave room to grow through a more aggressive tune, which is why I find it more appealing than the 18g.

As far as top mounts go, I was looking at the TurboXS, they are thicker than any other TMIC i've looked at and not more than an inch shorter by any other measurement. I've heard thicker is better as far as TMIC go, and you can get the TurboXS cheaper than APS or Perrin.
Just some more things to think about in your decision....

Yes, the HTA68 will reach your goal of 300whp but lets say it does so at 18-19PSI. An 18g does so at 15-16PSI, as such it will be running much cooler, less strain on the turbo, and lower EGTs. Also, Lag really is not much of an issue with the 2.5L and the area under the curve (usable power) w/an 18G great for a DD and is still a fairly small turbo.

My tuner told me this before choosing a turbo, "choose one that flows a little more than you currently want/need, as you will get used to it and want more." This statement alone made me change my decision from an EVO3 16G-8cm to an 18G-8cm.

Lastly, as far as TMICs go the "best one" is the Spearco unit. I have the Perrin and it works great for me. Just get the best used one you can find, and if it is the Spearco so be it.
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#25 Old 08-21-2009, 04:42 PM
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i appreciate the in depth research/opinion. ill look more into the 18G setup. i was thinking about buying the turboXS tmic. looks huge.
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#26 Old 08-21-2009, 08:44 PM
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Just some more things to think about in your decision....

Yes, the HTA68 will reach your goal of 300whp but lets say it does so at 18-19PSI. An 18g does so at 15-16PSI, as such it will be running much cooler, less strain on the turbo, and lower EGTs. Also, Lag really is not much of an issue with the 2.5L and the area under the curve (usable power) w/an 18G great for a DD and is still a fairly small turbo.

My tuner told me this before choosing a turbo, "choose one that flows a little more than you currently want/need, as you will get used to it and want more." This statement alone made me change my decision from an EVO3 16G-8cm to an 18G-8cm.

Lastly, as far as TMICs go the "best one" is the Spearco unit. I have the Perrin and it works great for me. Just get the best used one you can find, and if it is the Spearco so be it.
I can appreciate that. I'm going to my local shop tomorrow and will run everything by him to see what he says. When does your 18g (blouch?) make boost, 3200? How well does it hold it till redline? Though I'm sure it holds boost better than the HTA68 on the top end, I do like the idea of fast spooling turbo that lets you feel the "punch" right around 3000
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#27 Old 08-21-2009, 08:56 PM
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The good thing about an 18G is they're more common so a little cheaper too. Use that money on porting and polishing. It'll make up some of the spool you lost by going to something bigger. The TD05-18G is perfectly suited for the EJ255 to me.

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#28 Old 08-21-2009, 09:44 PM
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The good thing about an 18G is they're more common so a little cheaper too. Use that money on porting and polishing. It'll make up some of the spool you lost by going to something bigger. The TD05-18G is perfectly suited for the EJ255 to me.
TD05 18g better suited for 2.5L than TD06 18g? Also, 18g's have been around for awhile, what are some reputable brands that have delivered stellar performance to its cost and have proven reliable (no cracking etc)?:
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#29 Old 08-21-2009, 09:59 PM
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The O5 housing will have slightly better spool than the O6 housing, but some say that it does sometimes have creep issues. If I were looking at a turbo like this it would be blouchturbo.com hands down. Great turbos, great customer service, and the PnP and upgraded lines are all options to get when ordering the turbo.

A tid bit my tuner told me, the port and polishing on the 18 or 20Gs is next to not noticable at all. He said with a good 3port BCS and other supporting mods of the turbo, its just money you spend. Better money spent would be on wrapping the DP and/or ceramic coating the turbo.

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Stage 2 2005 WRX
Cobbtuning.com"
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#30 Old 08-22-2009, 12:28 AM
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now that im thinkn about it. i might go with a 20G turbo from blouch. with the TD05 housing cause it spools faster, and just ceramic coat it. get 750-850cc injectors with the turboxs tmic and the wally fuel pump.

newtothegame- is there anything in particular i need to watch out with the 20G turbo. i saw that u had some problems with the up pipe fitment and all. anything i need to be weary about before i go a head with the setup??
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