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riley_yerk 09-06-2010 07:13 PM

22 or 25 mm Sway Bars and Which Brand.
I am looking to get new sway bars for my 09 WRX wagon. I am new to the whole modding scene and I just would like to know the differences in performance between a 22mm and a 25mm sway bar.

man show 09-07-2010 12:15 PM

I recently upgraded the sway bars and endlinks on my 2007 WRX after reading a whole bunch of stuff about them. From what I gathered, 24 mm is about as big as you want to go in the front and 22 mm in the rear [U]for a daily driven car with an otherwise stock suspension[/U]. If you're going to track the car, you probably want to upgrade other things besides the sways and endlinks and then you can certainly go as big as you want. I purchased Whiteline 24f/22r adjustable bars and I have my front bar on the stiff setting and the rear bar in the middle and I'm absolutely amazed at the improvement over stock. Basically, if you want to have similar handling characteristics as a stock car (understeer through turns: front end will lose grip before the rear and the car will side off the road nose-first), you want the front bar to be slightly bigger than the rear. If your rear bar is bigger than the front bar, you will experience oversteer - or worst case, snap-oversteer - where the tail end of the car will whip around through aggressive turns and you're likely to spin out. Oversteer, and especially snap-oversteer, aren't safe at all: imagine making an extremely aggressive turn/swerve in an emergency situation... you would be better off having the front end start to lose grip so you could apply the brakes or let off the gas momentarily to regain control instead of having the back end whip around and losing all control instantly. Besides being safer, you'll actually be able to go through turns faster with some understeer where you could let off the gas for a split-second until you regain grip and get back on the throttle as opposed to oversteer where you'd have to counter-steer and slide which would slow you down more.

Here's some good info on all aspects of modding: [url=]Unabomber's Manifesto - NASIOC[/url]

smurfwagon 09-09-2010 02:03 AM

i have an 07 wrx wagon and i bought Perrins 25mm front and rear sways with front and rear endlinks and from what ive heard they dont make that good of sway bars (bad fitment among the biggest problem) wish i new that before i bought them cause i would have gone with Whiteline. i only have the front one installed due to time restraints not by choice, and i notice a lot more oversteer which is supposed to happen due to the extra stiffness in the front i guess. ive heard that you need wagon specific sway bars and im not sure if thats true or not, CAN anyone validate that as true or false?!, cause if its true i might need to order new sway bars. lol after all the negative reviews ive heard about perrins sways id say go with the whiteline sways.(i feel like a traitor saying that, having Perrin sways, but sadly its the truth). research research research the parts you are going to buy and consider your entire suspension set up before spending all that cash, i learned the hard way and im hoping you learn from my mistake. : /

pzr2874 09-09-2010 05:06 AM

Their website doesn't distinguish the wagon from the sedan... call them.

Or ask wagonracer on here... he'd know for sure.

VisiX 09-09-2010 08:31 AM

I had whiteline sways with kartboy endlinks on my 07wrx, it worked good but the fitment was kind of off and I had to use washers to line everything up. I've read that the whiteline bars work fine with stock endlinks so I have to blame KB on that one.

I now have Perrin bars with kartboy endlinks on my 09STi. Fitment is perfect, I think the issue smurf is talking about with Perrin bars was an old problem that has since been resolved. I've run the adjustable bars on both settings in the front and 2 of the 3 settings in the back and I have no clunking or issues installing or lining everything up. I have a lot of Perrin parts (TBE, Shift adapter, sways, strut tower bar) and all the parts are quality. Also, Perrin's customer service has been top notch for me.

man show 09-09-2010 09:00 AM

Whiteline rear sway bars are the same for all 02-07 sedans and wagons. Whiteline does, however, list different front sway bars specific to 02-07 wagons and 02-07 sedans. I think it's because the front end of the 02-07 wagons are slightly narrower than the 02-07 sedans (they have slightly narrower fenders as well). And now I'm actually thinking that I might have been better off with a Wagon front sway bar because if my front bar was slightly narrower, I would have that tiny bit of extra clearance between the Kartboy front endlink bolts and the Whiteline bar (see issue described below). I'll have to take a look the next time I'm under the car... that makes me wonder.

Regarding the fitment issue: On my 07 WRX, I was initially able to get the Kartboy front endlinks to fit with the Whiteline 24 mm front sway bar using spacers, but I didn't like the way everything fit. With and without spacers, the Kartboy endlink hardware was just too ridiculously close to the bar and I was afraid that the slightest sideways suspension shift would cause them to make contact, so I decided to reinstall my stock front endlinks. The stock front 02-07 endlinks are a very solid design (as opposed to the stock rear 02-07 endlinks which are plastic) and the slightest angle that they mount at combined with the fact that there aren't bolts protruding out of the back of them toward the bar provides more than enough clearance between the bar and links. I can easily adjust between either of the two sets of holes on the Whiteline 24 mm front bar using the stock front endlinks. Also, the way the front endlink bolts pivot makes them SO much easier to line up and get through the holes. I really had to wrestle with the Kartboy solid front links and the Whiteline bar to get the bolts through the holes when I was mocking everything up for the first time. If I were to use any other aftermarket front links, I would choose a design similar to the stock front endlinks - adjustable pillowball mount, as opposed to a solid mount. I had absolutely no fitment issues in the rear with my Perrin Stout Mounts, Whiteline 22 mm rear sway bar, and Kartboy rear endlinks. Adjusting between any of the 3 adjustment holes is a piece of cake.

Regarding the clunking issue: I heard a clunking issue from my front end after installing the Whiteline front sway bar and stock front endlinks, but I resolved the issue by tightening the front endlink bolts beyond the recommend torque specs. I definitely didn't have the bolts nearly tight enough the first time around and they were slowly working their way loose every time the car would go over a little bump in the road causing the endlink bolts to jiggle around the slightest bit in the sway bar holes. I also used a dab of blue threadlocker for good measure. I'm fairly confident that most of the clunking issues you hear about are because of loose endlink bolts. Crank on them a bit and the noise will probably disappear. Obviously, squeaking means the bushings need to be re-greased, so I'll see how that holds up over time and I'll report back if/when I have to re-grease any of my polyurethane bushings.

basco 09-09-2010 09:41 AM

John there more that quite a bit narrower...almost an inch to an inch and a half

man show 09-09-2010 09:55 AM

Ah, well maybe that wouldn't work then... that won't stop me from taking a look anyway the next time I'm changing my oil :)

That kind of clearance would actually probably work for me though. I just have to see if the insides of the bar would contact the frame or whatever else might be in the way. I'm still just curious.

The shape of the bar should be the same, right? I'm guessing the length would just be a little shorter...

smurfwagon 09-09-2010 10:09 AM

Perrin does make some quality parts il give them that. turns out what basco said is true cause i have a wrx front sway bar and the top bolt on the endlink rubs the inside of my rim when i turn from lock to lock. last night unfortunately the rim weight on the inside of the rim caught the top bolt of my endlink and rolled it forward causing the endlinks top bolt to be infront of the rear bolt making them sit horizontally instead of verticle. : ( is that bad for the front sway bar to roll like that, nothing broke but i just want to make sure theres no hidden problems im not aware of. (looks like i got some work under the car tonight : ) ) anyone know where i can get a front sway for an 07 wagon or maybe what brand makes them??

man show 09-09-2010 10:57 AM

:: ahem :: Whiteline :: cough ::


smurfwagon 09-18-2010 01:36 PM

can anyone find a front sway bar larger than 22mm for an 07 wrx wagon? all i can find is whitelines 22mm (solid). i have perrins 25mm in the rear so i wanna match it in the front. what would be the disadvantages to having a smaller sway in the front than the rear other then the rear end breaking loose more easily???

man show 09-19-2010 11:42 AM

A larger sway bar in the rear and a smaller one up front will cause the rear end to break loose and whip around more easily - also known as oversteer - which actually makes you slower around turns because you'll have to countersteer to correct your path of travel which is contrary to the fastest line through a curve. In emergency situations where you have to change lanes or make an otherwise sudden movement to one side or the other, the car can experience what is known as snap-oversteer which could put you into a dangerous spin.

If you go with Whiteline's 22 mm adjustable solid front sway bar for WRX wagons, you can use the stiffer setting to make the bar act as a 24 mm bar.

If you don't want the Whiteline bar, here's another option: [url=]ADMotorsports 25mm Front Sway Bar (Adj) - WRX Wagon Subaru Wagon WRX 25mm Sway bar Front [ADsf0207] - $185.00 : AD Motorsports, AD Motorsports is your source for quality performance products![/url]

It appears as though Hotchkis also makes a WRX wagon-specific front sway bar, but most of those appear to be sold as a set along with a Hotchkis rear bar. I'm sure if you shopped around, you could probably find only the front bar somewhere.

smurfwagon 09-25-2010 01:48 PM

Thanks man show! i was searchin for a while and couldnt come up with that website on google. ha i ordered it and it should be here by wednesday. cant wait to install it and head for the canyons and test it.

goldendome88 12-10-2010 05:47 AM

what size Perrin sways did you go with? I am looking into them now and haven't decided on size. Also looking to go with the KB endlinks

overtorqued 04-02-2011 09:02 PM

Just to throw another option out there, I bought front and rear sways for my 2008 wrx wagon from Rallitek. I went with the "street" package (22m front, 19mm rear). Very happy with the Ralliteks and I do recommend them. No fitment problems at all, and a huge improvement over stock. Of course, the 08 wrx's came a lot softer than the 09's. These feel great, but if I had to do it again I would probably opt for the stiffer "track" package only because I've since decided to upgrade springs and shocks too.
One thing - I asked the guy at my shop about endlinks and if I should upgrade them too. His opinion is that they're really not necessary. Most people upgrade them and don't know why. So I chose not to.

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