TMIC or FMIC - Subaru WRX Forum
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#1 Old 08-04-2011, 08:39 PM
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TMIC or FMIC

got a 11 wrx and lookin at puttin either a tmic or a fmic on it...have heard good and bad bout both. I am a daily driver but want a little more outta the car. Im currently at stage 2 and im extremely happy with it but was wondering what the wonders of a larger intercooler would have....i have looked at a few brands, ams, godspeed...etc...what yall suggest?
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#2 Old 08-04-2011, 09:42 PM
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If your going to invest in another intercooler other than to get away from the exploding form fitted plastic ones. I would go front mount, easy decision in my mind. Heat soak is a b****, I noticed zero difference in spool, and enough knock reduction to get another degree or 2 of timing safely and push the turbo a bit harder. Honestly the top mounts will work pretty well for the VF52, BUT if I was going to lay the cash down I would get a front mount, I ran my stock top mount until it exploded on me.
I would invest in a different fuel method first, either meth or E85 will notice much larger gains, unless you get a smoken deal on an intercooler.
-Carl
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#3 Old 08-04-2011, 10:53 PM
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i was in your boat at one point. was basically stage 2 then went FMIC and BOV with a blow through set up and then got tuned. here are the results.

09 wrx, FMIC, Blow-through tuning done!!

peak numbers may have been only 21hp and 49tq but in the mid range you can see much more than that.

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
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#4 Old 08-04-2011, 11:45 PM
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It all depends on what you want out of your car in the end. If you plan on going big on your build then go fmic, if not a nice top mount will be fine. I run a tmic with a 20g and a built motor and it works great, it's defiantly my limiting factor as of now but I'm putting down plenty of power with it. A lot of other people run a tmic wit 20g sized turbos with no problems. The nice thing about a tmic is you get to keep a sleeper look much safer in case of a front end collision and you can run any intake you want including the stock box. Like you said there are ups and downs with either one, what ever you choose will be better then the stock junk tho.
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#5 Old 08-05-2011, 10:05 AM
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I wouldn't worry about a FMIC till you upgrade your turbo.

Rule of thumb, if the FMIC retails for less than $800 (that doesn't mean you can't pay less ), don't waste your time.
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#6 Old 08-05-2011, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by black beast2 View Post
It all depends on what you want out of your car in the end. If you plan on going big on your build then go fmic, if not a nice top mount will be fine. I run a tmic with a 20g and a built motor and it works great, it's defiantly my limiting factor as of now but I'm putting down plenty of power with it. A lot of other people run a tmic wit 20g sized turbos with no problems. The nice thing about a tmic is you get to keep a sleeper look much safer in case of a front end collision and you can run any intake you want including the stock box. Like you said there are ups and downs with either one, what ever you choose will be better then the stock junk tho.
I love you... Trust me heat soak is not that bad unless you live at the drag strip or run a friggin' GT30 or some big turbo like that. Once the car gets moving the heat will dissipate within a few seconds. Granted a FMIC is going to help with power output, but as stated above there are ups and downs to both. Just wrap exhaust and turbo and use cool tape on your intercooler to help keep temps down. If your really worried about the heat soak then use a water sprayer...

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#7 Old 08-05-2011, 04:02 PM
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After a couple road runs, every tmic I have ever run is so hot you can hardly touch them due to underhood temps, not to mention if you live somewhere warm, like I do, 95 deg temps in summer is the norm, some stop and go driving around town and your intercooler is hot enough to cook on. I can always touch my front mount and it's cool to the touch. You won't see any hard core tuners running top mounts on high performers. I did keep the top mount until mine exploded like I said, but if I was going to invest in one, it's a no brainer for me. It's obviously up to the end user, but it's like anything else, if you are going to lay a chunk of money down, why wouldn't you get the best possible solution? Any downfalls to a front mount are far outweighed by their advantages. Honestly the worst part is losing your bumper, that's a little sketchy...
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#8 Old 08-05-2011, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psinuse View Post
I love you... Trust me heat soak is not that bad unless you live at the drag strip or run a friggin' GT30 or some big turbo like that. Once the car gets moving the heat will dissipate within a few seconds. Granted a FMIC is going to help with power output, but as stated above there are ups and downs to both. Just wrap exhaust and turbo and use cool tape on your intercooler to help keep temps down. If your really worried about the heat soak then use a water sprayer...
It's nice to know someone cares...lol...Anyway I think it's hilarious how everybody is always talking about heat soak this heat soak that, like you have to have a front mount if you are stopped at a light for 10 seconds. I bought my tmic in 08 and pretty much the only one available was the AVO, so that's what I got. It is probably the smallest tmic on the market just smaller then the Perrin. I can run hard all day and it is still cool to the touch on the throttle body side, the turbo side is pretty hot but who cares. Like you said if ever there was a problem a little water spray would clear it right up. So bottom line is 9 out of 10 people will never have a problem with heat soak.
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#9 Old 08-05-2011, 04:30 PM
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I agree wth both Keith and black beast2 as far as running a TMIC. If you think 95 is hot, here in Kansas its been triple digits for over a month now and I have had no adverse effects running my TMIC. I could probably get a little more on the top end from a FMIC, but the stock look, the stock front bumper, and the better throttle response from a TMIC are what I was after, and couldnt be happier running one.

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Cobbtuning.com"
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#10 Old 08-05-2011, 04:31 PM
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To each his own . On a side note, even on road tunes, you can tell an obvious difference when that top mount heats up. I don't think it's something people just say. I am talking about running 20lbs, spinning a turbo around 80-90% wgdc's, and you don't have to be sitting for it to get hot. I would just have a really, really, hard time recommending something that has an engineering flaw. (Something that's supposed to cool your air down, sitting right over an oven.) You won't see any top mount's on factory Subaru race cars that's for sure. But, I am not trying to get anyone's feathers in a bunch. Just offering my opinion. If you like the top mount's great, but if you plan on doing serious mod's it's going to catch up to you in the end.
-Carl
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#11 Old 08-05-2011, 04:41 PM
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Serious mods? As in? Im just asking as maybe not me (as IM just a stock block 20G at 20PSI on 91OCT, built tranny), but I knew a few guys running the larger Dom series turbos (both 2.5 and 3.0 with TMIC, one is a member on here) and they pulled just fine, made great power, and of course like we are all trying to say the owners were very happy with the setup. A FMIC IMHO isnt needed until you go rotated, or think you are going to squeeze every last little bit of power out of your car.

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Cobbtuning.com"
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#12 Old 08-05-2011, 04:46 PM
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I went front mount after hours and hours of tuning, mostly road, and I could see my performance, knock patterns, and even boost spool affected by a hot top mount. Since I have went front mount these have all stopped. I am running a Dom 1.5XT-R, which isn't the largest turbo in the world but it's substantial compared to stock. My point is just this, if you are going to buy one, why buy something that already has issues with being right over the motor/turbo? I had mine blanketed, and a full wrap on it as well. I had zero throttle response or spool characteristic change. So it's hard for me to see suggesting putting something on I saw issue with, not trying to argue, just speaking from experience.
-Carl

All this was done before I got rid of the VF52(it blew up, like previously stated). I have been on front mount ever since and wouldn't dream of going backwards. Like I said, if you are putting out the cash, it's hard to not suggest what I think works better.
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#13 Old 08-05-2011, 04:58 PM
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I agree that the top mount has limited me from pushing my turbo to the max and a fmic would alow me to turn the boost up. My point is 90% of people dont mod their car to the point where its gonna make that big of a differance, the majority of people who have front mounts have them for the bling factor esspecially thoes running stock turbos. I dont necessarly think a tmic is a engineering flaw, thats what your big ass hole in the hood is for. like i said before my tb side is always cool to the touch, unless im drag racing all day and then a bag of ice between runs cools it right down, and that wouldnt even be needed if I had a sprayer. Im not hating on front mounts either as I will probably get one after I go bigger then the 20g, Im just saying Id rather spend $800 0n a good tmic then $1300 on a fmic if I was never going beyond a 20g in turbo size.
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#14 Old 08-05-2011, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by newtothegame View Post
Serious mods? As in?
I was about to ask the same question as I feel my mods are pretty serious, at least my wallet thiks so!Cry!
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#15 Old 08-05-2011, 05:05 PM
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I agree on the "bling factor", however I initially did not want a big funky looking grin on my wrx. I wanted to get a top mount, but can say from experience now, that I would not go back. Most people probably don't need one, even though on any setup you can get a bit more timing if your running your turbo near its peak efficiency and blowing some hot air, it's a noticeable improvement. Again, my only point was if you have 2 sitting in front of you and you are GOING to buy one of them, why not get the better setup? And, the top mount was engineered to save space and allow a more trouble free mount of the bumper, not necessarily a "flaw" but they would not have designed it like that if they weren't worried about customer approval or safety tests. If it were a performance only car, off road only, it would not come with a top mount, no reason to.
I do like the discussion, and I hope no one is taking offense I am certainly not intending to offend anyone.
-Carl
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