My Phase III Project - 09 WRX HB - Page 5 - Subaru WRX Forum
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#61 Old 02-22-2010, 06:04 PM
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Fourth attempt to pick up the car: In 1 hr.

Got a call from them and it's is finally done. We didn't go over numbers over the phone so I am still in the dark. I will post my numbers tonight.
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#62 Old 02-22-2010, 06:20 PM
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lol i get excited hearing my car pull on the dyno and wondering the numbers! cant imagin days and then having to drive somewhere to go find out!
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#63 Old 02-22-2010, 11:47 PM
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Here's the final result. I am bummed that I didn't get to see the final dyno pull. I am more bummed that the final result was the one I saw 4 days ago.

294 whp
302 wtq
That was done around 4 p.m.
Temperature was around 75F and 60% Humidity

THE LEAK:
The boost leak was detected after ther Perrin TMIC and before the throttle body. They end up having to use an industrial T-bolt clamp to tighten it. My boost is 18.6 psi (3rd gear) but it reads 20.5 - 21.3 on the AP log. I was told that the gear ratio will affect the psi in a way that 4th and 5th gear will have higher boost (well, I don't get it, but that's what I was told)

INTAKE:
I was very unhappy going home without an actual final dyno sheet with me, then I told myself to look beyond the numbers. I need to see how it actually drives. The Blitz intake is a lot louder than I expected. You cannot miss the spooling and it starts around 2500 rpm. It is so loud that it can replace the BOV - that saves me $295 (was going to get the COBB BPV). This can be controlled by going easy on the gas pedal.

HEADER:
The header did not change the exhaust note a bit. This is actually perfect because I did not want it any louder. I like the subtleness of the Perrin exhaust.

INJECTOR DUTY CYCLE:
After upgrading to 800cc injectors, my AP is telling me that I am running at 60% IDC compared to 100% before on my 550cc stock injectors.

SPARK PLUG:
I got the NGK 1 step colder spark plug. Whoever has aftermarket spark plugs, please tell me if you notice any difference to the idling sound. I am not sure if it is just my imagination, but when I have my hood opened and it's just idling, I can hear a more distinct ta.ta.ta.ta.ta.ta.ta.ta.ta.... (if it makes any sense)

OVERALL FEELING:
At first I was surprised how little difference the 50 horses make to the power when I test drove it. I was looking for more of a kick. When I first got my WRX, I was very pleasantly surprised by how much kick it has once it reached 3000 rpm. After looking at the dyno graph, I realized that I should be looking at something different. The stock torque curve is the highest at around 3K rpm and tapers down. My new torque curve reached the pretune level about 500 rpm later (thanks to the biggest intake and inlet hose), but it peaks at 4700 rpm. When I really stepped on the gas, there are definitely more power in the higher rpm which I wasn't getting before. Also, the response is a lot quicker.

LIMITATION:
After watching the dyno pulls, I realized how quickly the bigger Perrin TMIC heats up and affects the performance. Although it allows the turbo to spool up about 500 rpm quicker than the FMIC, but the higher temperature in the engine bay really hurts the power. Is a carbon fiber hood with more vents going to help or it just creates more turbulence inside the engine bay?

CEL:
Another weird thing is that after 25mile drive from the shop to home, I wanted to let the car idle for a while before turning it off, and all of a sudden, it was giving me a CEL (looks like it was in the limp mode). I quickly disconnected the battery and reset the ECU. The idling was rough for a while. I hesitated to do more testing and decided to take a dinner break. After the break, I started it up again and saw no CEL, so I went out for another test drive. It seemed fine after that run. Was my ECU trying to learn my new parts? Can't figure that one out. I am going to call the tuner tomorrow about this.
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#64 Old 02-23-2010, 12:25 AM
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i have to say from the get go, everything you have said has made me totally not like the tuner or the place where you got your parts and what they said about parts. its just my .02 but seems like deep down in your writing your not happy either!! you get a cel right after a tune makes no sense! your ecu wasnt trying to learn anything. i was just told what to learn for a few days on a dyno. im not sure if the shop or tuner is only subis or all cars, but id try to find a different one in your area. try COBB's website, search dealers and tuners will pop up also. i no all dynos read different so numbers mean nothing but you got a base run done first! your upgrades do NOT add up to the new numbers.

lets say we use the dynos boost numbers which i think are way off! first it said 15psi where perrin does 18psi for stage 2. now your at 18.6 you say. were they trying to target 19psi? no matter do you really think 3.6psi would only improve 10 or so foot pounds of torque???? and thats not even including the intake and headers ect. now if you use your AP psi you still should of been at 18psi and now are at 20-21. thats still 2-3psi and only showing a 10 or so TQ improvement.

i said before we tried out 18psi on my car but the stock intercooler got way to hot. before 4500rpm and we had to shut it down, we still got a 15-20tq more over the 17psi. that was only 1psi more with no more parts thrown on. you hit 3psi which should be 20-30tq more at least!!

like i said numbers mean nothing because its hot, its humid, the dyno could read really really low. but headers, intake, inlet, 3psi more boost should show 30-50tq more no matter what! something isnt right.

EDIT:the comment on higher gears equals higher boost is nuts! your ecu was targeted for XXpsi. your boost control solnoid will reach that point and then start to bleed off. the gear has NOTHING to do with it! the turbo spools and pushed boost plan and simple.

theres only one thing i can think of for the numbers not being better. i trust your AP, at 20-21psi your stock BPV and your stock 2-port BCS can NOT handle that. the BPV WILL leak very soon and the 2-port cant not hold the proper boost pressure at that psi.

if your want my advice spend $100 and get a grimmspeed 3-port EBCS, $200 on a turbo xs BPV, and get a retune with someone who only works with subis, does 75% of the tuning on the street, and 25% on the dyno.
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#65 Old 02-23-2010, 12:54 AM
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i just looked on COBB website, EDO is a protuner for subis. i also see BoostAddicts tuner is in Redondo Beach, church automotive testing which should be right near you. id give him a call seriously, at least pay $50 for 3 base runs and have church look at the numbers and stuff. just a double check and piece of mind.
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#66 Old 02-23-2010, 12:57 AM
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synolimit,

Man, I really appreciate you looking out for me. After reading your reply, I need to work out something with them. 1) Get the 3-port BCS, 2) get another dyno with them, 3) resolve the CEL that came on and did not reappear.

To their defense, they work on many STis, WRXs, and EVOs. The owner has a few Subies and he's tuned a bunch of them.

The original torque pretty much spiked at 3200 rpm and died down pretty quickly to 263 wtq at 4K and 243 at 5K. My new torque is above 290 wtq from 3700 rpm to 5200 rpm and peaked at 4700. So the band is much wider.

It's only $50 for 3 runs? Do they use DynoJet?
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#67 Old 02-23-2010, 01:20 AM
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It's $50 in Ohio and I believe they use a dynapac. As for your wider range that totally makes sence. However not the 1500rpm later spike.

Currently on my tune I'm 311tq from 3700rpm-4500rpm. At 5k I'm still at 290! At 5500-270, 6k 255 and 6500-220. That why I'm still thinkin a second place and another set of eyes should do u good. If it only costs $50 for a look and base runs.
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#68 Old 02-23-2010, 01:34 AM
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I will see if they will do something for me. I will probably stop by Redono Beach for a second opinion. You have spark plugs right? Do you notice any difference on your idle?
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#69 Old 02-23-2010, 09:12 AM
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Accually I did. No noise or anything but it doesn't hold firm. It's programed at like 900 rpm but will drop to like 600-700 and feel like it's gonna turn off. I don't no if it the spark plugs but just something I notice. Doesn't happen all the time just little flutter here and there at idle
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#70 Old 02-23-2010, 09:59 AM
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It's good that you also noticed something different. I am experiencing similar thing. I'd say it idles around 500-600 and it does sound like it's going to turn off, but it doesn't happen all the time. I hope this is normal. Can anyone else share their experience on the aftermarket spark plugs?
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#71 Old 02-23-2010, 10:47 AM
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My car does that every now and then and I'm on stock plugs... Usually when I come to a stop or what not.

-Chris
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#72 Old 02-23-2010, 12:48 PM
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My car is turbo back, but has always idled around 5-600 rpm's when stopped. Ever since the Perrin Light Weight Pulley was put on it has a tendency to drop a bit harder when getting on it and then clutching in to neutral, but never had a problem with it running rough or anything. Those 'one step colder' plugs must be putting out some good power I'd guess so it tricks the ECU. I'm curious about how the plugs run though. Please keep the updates and posts coming as you sort out how they work.

Joe

Only use roads to get to the dirt; Then keep it sideways! >;D
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#73 Old 02-23-2010, 02:55 PM
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Latest development: They've agreed to dyno my car one last time to see the result next Monday (3/1/10) at 8 a.m. I am happy that they are willing to right the wrong.

Don't get me wrong, I am happy with the performance, I just want to be able to justify the investment I've put into this car and get a real score card on the gain.

I've also convinced myself that if the tune is less aggressive, all the parts are going to last longer. Is this kind of thought allowed in here?
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#74 Old 02-23-2010, 03:36 PM
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Yeah if he gave you a conservative tune your engine and trans/diffs etc will be happier longer. If he gave you a bad tune, however, tranny may not be affected but the engine probably won't be happy very long.

From the sounds of it Sean Church is the go-to tuning guy in SoCal, and if I lived there I would use him.

-Chris
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#75 Old 02-23-2010, 05:11 PM
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smokin joes probable right about the idle. its the LWP not the plugs! if i rev it up it will drop harder down to 500rpm or so then raise back up to 900ish. i forgot about that part haha.

and i say go to chruch again. you may not even have to though. i dont know a hole lot about the AP but cant you take logs and email them to church? he could just look at them and call you back if he see's anything he doesnt like.
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