2011 wrx build :) - Page 14 - Subaru WRX Forum
 1Likes
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
#196 Old 12-08-2011, 03:29 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Colorado
Posts: 218
cwinterbower is more helpful than not
Garage
Man whoever tuned this has very different ideas about tuning than I. The wastegate duty is falling right in there as far as tuning so that's about as close as you can get for tuning out spikes, although with a stiff spring its hard to keep your boost perfect. Since I didn't read this entire thread I am going to assume you have a 3 port, in which case your compensation for +/- should be almost doubled from stock form so it makes quicker adjustments. And..your wastegate with those kind of numbers is already opening before you hit peak boost, my wastegate duty is 100% until 18lbs and then opens up quick, vs slowly creeping open as soon as boost starts coming on. With duty cycles that low the manifold pressure is already cracking the wastegate open at low boost, but with a spring that stiff it would be very hard to tune a spike out leaving it shut till the last second. Making any sense?
But my main question was if it was bottoming out, which it's not.
cwinterbower is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#197 Old 12-08-2011, 03:41 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
synolimit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,415
synolimit is a helpful contributing member
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwinterbower View Post
wow....your ecu is sorta guessing, it has nothing to go on. You really need to have that table changed as you go well beyond 3.4 load, that looks like a stock rom table. Mine along the top row goes to 4.75, but if you do that you will basically have to redo the entire table and all the compensation tables to go with it, I am wondering how many of your other tables are left in the stock form. I mean requested torque is just a number, like your boost table uses etc, (even though I changed mine there as well), but your ecu relies heavily upon g/revs based off your maf, and you are well beyond that table so it's sorta guessing at the values using a set of rules.
Step one, get that top row correct extending load out to at least 4.25 and match all your tables in your timing...What does your open loop fueling look like? It's the same deal.

***NOTE, do not just change the row and not change your timing values to match up, even though it would effectively bring your timing down, you still need to try to match it up as close as possible. Jot down what your timing value is at say 5000rpms and 3.4 g/rev, and then match that number by adjusting the entire table accordingly when you change the top row, minus a couple degrees to stay safe.**

Sadly, this is almost a full on tune. I don't mind helping in any way I can, but depends on what you are thinking of doing.
You can get the timing close as I suggested and then run a log, and bump timing up a half degree until you see knock and then back it off about 1.25 degrees if you want max tune.
ok this is starting to make sense now. i told him i drive like a Gma in winter so maybe he had no need to go above 3.40. 3.40 was the stage 2 tune that he worked off of. plus im not over 4000rpm to often. i just checked the stock table for timing and its only 2.70. my plan is to leave it for now and just stay under 4k. come spring im going back for more and a dyno. i think he just made the DD safe and a little bit of boost to have a little fun with.

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
synolimit is offline  
#198 Old 12-08-2011, 07:09 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
synolimit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,415
synolimit is a helpful contributing member
Quote:
Originally Posted by cwinterbower View Post
Man whoever tuned this has very different ideas about tuning than I. The wastegate duty is falling right in there as far as tuning so that's about as close as you can get for tuning out spikes, although with a stiff spring its hard to keep your boost perfect. Since I didn't read this entire thread I am going to assume you have a 3 port, in which case your compensation for +/- should be almost doubled from stock form so it makes quicker adjustments. And..your wastegate with those kind of numbers is already opening before you hit peak boost, my wastegate duty is 100% until 18lbs and then opens up quick, vs slowly creeping open as soon as boost starts coming on. With duty cycles that low the manifold pressure is already cracking the wastegate open at low boost, but with a spring that stiff it would be very hard to tune a spike out leaving it shut till the last second. Making any sense?
But my main question was if it was bottoming out, which it's not.
ya makes sense. what doesnt is what just happened. i talked to my etuner and i went and added .3 fuel because he said to as it wont hurt HP as much as pulling timing or boost. and because i was knocking, adding the fuel will make more HP because i wont lose HP because of pulled timing.

why it doesnt make sense. first run 3300-4100rpm -2.8* ( a new spot for the -2.8*). second run -1.4* like yesterday. the second run drops the *. however it started at 2900 and by 5300 it kept dropping (-1.4*, -1.05*, -.70* except when i got to 4400 it shot up to -2.1*). the third run even better only -.70* down to -.35*. after i shut the car off and reset the logger...ZERO knock for 4th run! from 2600-5600rpm


first. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...FNCSFdtTEoycVE

second. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...2gwTzN4TU82TXc

third. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...WlaUkhkeW5meXc

4th. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...1dYZV9NVDJiSVE

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
synolimit is offline  
#199 Old 12-08-2011, 08:45 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
synolimit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,415
synolimit is a helpful contributing member
Quote:
Originally Posted by blk05WRX View Post
Hey,

I would be a bit worried about the feedback knock correction, especially if it doesn't find it's way back to zero quickly. Fine knock isn't good either. They should both be at zero on a full throttle pull on a smooth surface.

Check out this video that Cobb put together. It will tell you what to look for when logging and what's acceptable and unacceptable. You may need a little more learning time with regular driving. You could give it a few days of regular driving and then do a few more logs at full boost. If you still see the knock correction you will need to get a hold of tuner. I'd call him soon to tell him about the knock you're seeing.

cobbtuning's Channel - YouTube


I don't have a whole lot of experience tuning. I just starting working with a friend on his built E85 EVO. He's been tuning using open source and we did a couple of pulls and he showed me a few things to look for. I only logged my car to make sure nothing was wrong and my logs showed 0's for the whole run in the Fine knock and feedback knock correction.

Here's my log. I hope this helps.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...hl=en_US#gid=0
checking your log again i think i might go back to draw through. your MAF never drops in g/s while mine has 10-20 drops all the way up. i think this is a problem.

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
synolimit is offline  
#200 Old 12-08-2011, 10:17 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Colorado
Posts: 218
cwinterbower is more helpful than not
Garage
Depends on how your tuner tuned open loop. I am guessing with those random drops, keep in mind sometimes this is normal, may be due to him using the maf scale to tune open loop. I prefer tuning with fuel table, because I like a nice linear maf scale and even load numbers. Can you post an image of your maf scale with graph?
And if your still knocking intermittently with high 10's for fuel ratio I would still be inclined to dial back timing just a bit for piece of mind, even .5 degree's from 2500 + at loads 2+, won't notice any power gains maybe 4 horses on a dyno on top, but would keep you in the clear much better.
cwinterbower is offline  
#201 Old 12-08-2011, 11:30 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
synolimit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,415
synolimit is a helpful contributing member
maf scale with graph? check your PM

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
synolimit is offline  
#202 Old 12-12-2011, 01:01 AM
WRXtuners Member
 
synolimit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,415
synolimit is a helpful contributing member
thought id post this up. Chris was nice enough to put a log into an air boy dyno for me. i have heard they read lower and Chris said close to a mustang dyno. i no my tuner has a brand new mustang and their old dynojet now. every car that has been on both right after another has shown a 15.2% difference in favor of the dynojet. id say these numbers are pretty right on because at the same boost with less parts on the dynojet my car put down 330hp/360tq. so add this, subtract that etc etc it pretty much works out. i do like that it works off more real world numbers, car weight, temp, humidity, wind, time it takes to go from X to X and it spits out a calculated number. cars not done yet, little more timing and boost i hope. maybe not on winter fuel but summer im sure we can! plus these 50 lb wheels/tires dont help.

Chris ill try to get a 2k to 6600 this week. not sure it makes a difference but whatever. i know full boost hits at 3300rpm, id like to see the tq hit around there too and not at 4300 rpm. im not sure if thats how it works or because i didnt punch it till 2900 rpm or whatever.

thanks a ton for everyone thats helped!! you know who you are!


Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
synolimit is offline  
#203 Old 12-12-2011, 09:57 AM
WRXtuners Member
 
blk05WRX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Illinois
Posts: 425
Images: 6
blk05WRX is known to be trustworthy and helpful blk05WRX is known to be trustworthy and helpful
I saw you're planning to run a few months on this tune. Don't you think it's worth going back given the weirdness with you A/F and the knock. Did you pay for the tune, or was someone just helping you out?

If you paid for the tune from a reputable shop, I'd head back. I'd hate to see you pop a ringland or something from the knock.

2005 WRX Cobb Stage 2
2009 Outback
blk05WRX is offline  
#204 Old 12-12-2011, 10:55 AM
WRXtuners Member
 
synolimit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,415
synolimit is a helpful contributing member
O no I paid for a hole tune at a shop! A new someone helped me out though. Now there's zero knock, good A/F, and only some minor tweaking now. I wouldn't push a wot run unless I was 100% sure everything was fine.

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
synolimit is offline  
#205 Old 12-12-2011, 07:34 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
turmic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 4,371
Images: 6
turmic is a WRX expert worth listening to turmic is a WRX expert worth listening to turmic is a WRX expert worth listening to turmic is a WRX expert worth listening to
Send a message via AIM to turmic
I'm still a skeptic until someone does a dyno run on a factory calibrated mustang dyno and plugs that log into airboy and it comes out pretty close. Otherwise I can't see a calculated run being accurate. A bumpy road or depending on when one person floors it vs how another person floors it for the log could really sway results.

Kirt
378awhp/373wtq Custom Dom 3 & CBRD tuned 2006 STI.
"When in doubt...flat out" - Colin McRae
turmic is offline  
#206 Old 12-12-2011, 08:28 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
blk05WRX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Illinois
Posts: 425
Images: 6
blk05WRX is known to be trustworthy and helpful blk05WRX is known to be trustworthy and helpful
I'm not sure about airboy, but I use Virtual Dyno. It has setting for a Mustang Dyno and a Dyno Jet. My run was within a few horsepower of Cobb's Stage 2 graph on their website.

My friends EVO came out with a 7 horsepower difference from the dynojet at AMS performance. We came up with 497 on the road and the dyno jet said 504. Pretty amazing.

Try it out and donate if you like it. He did a great job.


Virtual Dyno

2005 WRX Cobb Stage 2
2009 Outback
blk05WRX is offline  
#207 Old 12-12-2011, 09:26 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
synolimit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,415
synolimit is a helpful contributing member
at this point im not worried about if there that off. we'll see in the spring at the track for the numbers that really count.

I'll take a look at that virtual dyno, thanks

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/

Last edited by synolimit; 12-13-2011 at 01:44 AM.
synolimit is offline  
#208 Old 12-12-2011, 09:27 PM
WRXtuners Member
 
synolimit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,415
synolimit is a helpful contributing member
Double

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/

Last edited by synolimit; 12-13-2011 at 01:45 AM.
synolimit is offline  
#209 Old 12-13-2011, 12:33 AM
WRXtuners Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 10
rjklement15 is an unknown
Can I get a Complete list of your mods so I dont have t dig through the whole thread?
rjklement15 is offline  
#210 Old 12-13-2011, 01:41 AM
WRXtuners Member
 
synolimit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,415
synolimit is a helpful contributing member
Don't think I ever listed it

EXHAUST
Perrin EL header
GS EWP UP
Tail 38mm EWG
Invidia Catless DP
QTP 3" Cutout in mid pipe
TXS CBE

INTAKE
TXS CAI (just the pipe)
My 3" inlet
TXS FMIC
TXS RFL BOV
My blow through tube, 3"
JDM reversed manifold, no TGV's
Grimmspeed 8mm phenolic spacers
air pump deleted with kstech block off's

FUELING
parallel fuel lines
Walbro 255
DW 750cc

MISC.
Grimmspeed 3-port
AEM 3.5 bar MAP
Smy gauge bezel
Prosport boost gauge
Innovate wide band
15 lb battery
My grill craft grill

Suspension/drive train/wheels
Group n tranny mount
Tic cross bushings
Tic short shifter
Tic front SS bushings
Tic pitch stop
Tic middle drive shaft mounts
Kartboy rear shifter bushing
Whiteline rear diff inserts
Perrin lock down kit
Koni shocks
Rce yellow springs
RH evo j5 18x8.5 +44
246/35/18 conti dw

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
synolimit is offline  
Closed Thread


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On