2011 wrx build :) - Page 12 - Subaru WRX Forum
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post #166 of 315 Old 12-04-2011, 03:40 PM
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See you put the winter tires and steelies on. I bought some blizzak tires and steelies as well. But it was kind of plain to me and since I like the flashy look of the stock rims. I decided to make them a little more custom. I havent put them on the car yet since it only snow like a 1/2 inch a month ago and nothing is expected for awhile. So here they are sitting in the basement.

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post #167 of 315 Old 12-04-2011, 03:43 PM
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^ Links are fixed

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378awhp/373wtq Custom Dom 3 & CBRD tuned 2006 STI.
"When in doubt...flat out" - Colin McRae

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post #168 of 315 Old 12-07-2011, 06:57 PM Thread Starter
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finished tuning today. gotta say i missed the power! even at part throttle with no boost it feels 1000 times more powerful with tons of grunt ready to blast off. i told him because of winter fuel and stuff we should maybe keep the timing down and not worry about huge power till april/may. he targeted 21 psi with i believe almost 16psi taper. im not sure though on the taper because when i got home i did a few pulls. i could only get up to about 4800rpm because at about 4200 my feedback knock correction (4 byte) was reading -2.8* on the first run and -1.4* on the second. after that i called it quits. this is my first time logging my car beyond stage 2 so im not sure whats up or if feedback is worse or better than fine knock correction. still reading up on that now. i know these cars hate knock but im not sure just how much. ill try to figure it out though! any advice ill take it.

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
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post #169 of 315 Old 12-07-2011, 09:53 PM
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Hey,

I would be a bit worried about the feedback knock correction, especially if it doesn't find it's way back to zero quickly. Fine knock isn't good either. They should both be at zero on a full throttle pull on a smooth surface.

Check out this video that Cobb put together. It will tell you what to look for when logging and what's acceptable and unacceptable. You may need a little more learning time with regular driving. You could give it a few days of regular driving and then do a few more logs at full boost. If you still see the knock correction you will need to get a hold of tuner. I'd call him soon to tell him about the knock you're seeing.

cobbtuning's Channel - YouTube


I don't have a whole lot of experience tuning. I just starting working with a friend on his built E85 EVO. He's been tuning using open source and we did a couple of pulls and he showed me a few things to look for. I only logged my car to make sure nothing was wrong and my logs showed 0's for the whole run in the Fine knock and feedback knock correction.

Here's my log. I hope this helps.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...hl=en_US#gid=0

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post #170 of 315 Old 12-07-2011, 11:14 PM Thread Starter
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ill look into it all now. but before then i hope people can see these...

first run







second log




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http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
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post #171 of 315 Old 12-07-2011, 11:38 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blk05WRX View Post
Hey,

I would be a bit worried about the feedback knock correction, especially if it doesn't find it's way back to zero quickly. Fine knock isn't good either. They should both be at zero on a full throttle pull on a smooth surface.

Check out this video that Cobb put together. It will tell you what to look for when logging and what's acceptable and unacceptable. You may need a little more learning time with regular driving. You could give it a few days of regular driving and then do a few more logs at full boost. If you still see the knock correction you will need to get a hold of tuner. I'd call him soon to tell him about the knock you're seeing.

cobbtuning's Channel - YouTube


I don't have a whole lot of experience tuning. I just starting working with a friend on his built E85 EVO. He's been tuning using open source and we did a couple of pulls and he showed me a few things to look for. I only logged my car to make sure nothing was wrong and my logs showed 0's for the whole run in the Fine knock and feedback knock correction.

Here's my log. I hope this helps.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...hl=en_US#gid=0
cool thanks! i learned a lot about tuning and logging and learn so much better with video then reading. im glad the second run only went to -1.4 but i wish it started dropping. i did the logs about 30 minutes of highway driving and after i just left the tuner. i did think to myself "let at least 100 miles clock in before i get to worried." i have that now so tomorrow ill take another look.

lol closed course my ass!!!!

now im worried for my friend. i had no idea what IAM was. he's always at .5 when im at 1. ill have to let him know about that.

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http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
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post #172 of 315 Old 12-08-2011, 09:04 AM
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^If you want to send me the log in excel I can run an airboy for ya......

Always fun to compare #'s.

And yeah, you should see no knock correction of any kind. If you are, you're knocking. The amount of correction is really irrellevant, it's pulling timing because you're knocking. There really isn't any variation in the level of knock IMO (aka no knock is more or less severe than another knock, it's all knock aka exploding rather than burning fuel), the ECU just pulls different amount of timing until it figures out exactly how much it needs to pull out.

That's also why you're seeing the values for correction drop after the first log... The car may be able to pull timing out until it doesn't see any, but then it will start to add it back in until it knocks again, then back down, then back up again.... You get the point. It's best to set the timing lower than the knock threshold so the ecu can never put the car back into the range on its own.

-Chris
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post #173 of 315 Old 12-08-2011, 09:33 AM
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It could be "phantom knock" from engine noise/road noise.

Happens on several platforms from my experience. Still looking into it for the Speed.

Paul
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post #174 of 315 Old 12-08-2011, 10:08 AM
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Both logs are pretty consistent in showing that the ECU is pulling timing back from 15 when the knock correction comes in. So to me, it looks like too much timing or too much boost. I didn't see boost on your graphs. I'm assuming 21 like you said was your target, and that is a lot of boost. I've seen some tuners make more power with less boost and more timing. You just have to find the sweet spot.

I knew a guy who knew a guy that dropped forged pistons in and got phantom knock, or at least he thought it was. It cost him his built motor and now he's on number two.

You can sign up for a free Google Docs account (if you don't have gmail already) and upload your excel spreadsheet like I did. It's a little easier to read that way.

The next time you log you can reset the monitors to the defaults like was suggested in the video, then add A/F ratio.

You can download virtual dyno and drop your log in there. It's pretty cool and free. It will give you your horsepower reading.

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post #175 of 315 Old 12-08-2011, 10:15 AM
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^True, didn't think about boost.

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post #176 of 315 Old 12-08-2011, 10:42 AM
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Column L is his boot... Looks like about 21psi, which is pretty darn high even for 93. I'm only at 20.5 on E85 lol.

-Chris
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post #177 of 315 Old 12-08-2011, 10:53 AM Thread Starter
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yes boost is column L. first log was hitting 21.33 and second about 20.60. boost is set to...



not sure what the top numbers mean for requested torque

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post #178 of 315 Old 12-08-2011, 10:58 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RcrsWetDream View Post
^If you want to send me the log in excel I can run an airboy for ya......

Always fun to compare #'s.

And yeah, you should see no knock correction of any kind. If you are, you're knocking. The amount of correction is really irrellevant, it's pulling timing because you're knocking. There really isn't any variation in the level of knock IMO (aka no knock is more or less severe than another knock, it's all knock aka exploding rather than burning fuel), the ECU just pulls different amount of timing until it figures out exactly how much it needs to pull out.

That's also why you're seeing the values for correction drop after the first log... The car may be able to pull timing out until it doesn't see any, but then it will start to add it back in until it knocks again, then back down, then back up again.... You get the point. It's best to set the timing lower than the knock threshold so the ecu can never put the car back into the range on its own.
it worth it only going to 4900 rpm?

ya i never saw knock on stage 1 or 2. i am worried i still have OEM plugs. i mean my 09 put down 330hp with less parts then i have now. i am CERTAINLY well over 100hp from stock! it for sure doesnt look like phanton knock to me since its constant and not at the start of the run.

just tried a run a minute ago. -2.8* same time, same thing.

i have to disagree with others that 20-21psi is not high though for 93. for winter 93 maybe but not 93 all together. hell i plan on doing 22-24 because the turbo has it in it. at redline it only has about 16 maybe 17.

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http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
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post #179 of 315 Old 12-08-2011, 11:05 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blk05WRX View Post
Both logs are pretty consistent in showing that the ECU is pulling timing back from 15 when the knock correction comes in. So to me, it looks like too much timing or too much boost. I didn't see boost on your graphs. I'm assuming 21 like you said was your target, and that is a lot of boost. I've seen some tuners make more power with less boost and more timing. You just have to find the sweet spot.

I knew a guy who knew a guy that dropped forged pistons in and got phantom knock, or at least he thought it was. It cost him his built motor and now he's on number two.

You can sign up for a free Google Docs account (if you don't have gmail already) and upload your excel spreadsheet like I did. It's a little easier to read that way.

The next time you log you can reset the monitors to the defaults like was suggested in the video, then add A/F ratio.

You can download virtual dyno and drop your log in there. It's pretty cool and free. It will give you your horsepower reading.
yes and the log i just did, 15* hit -1.4* for a column then -2.8* for the rest and it dropped it to 13*. i do know the boost vs timing thing. lol i have no idea what to do with it though.

ill see about google docs now.

why reset and how? dont i have A/F now with my wideband on the log?

Scott-2011 WRX 335HP 394TQ 93 VF52!
http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
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post #180 of 315 Old 12-08-2011, 11:14 AM Thread Starter
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first

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...5Qm85RkE#gid=0

second

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...DTmJrTVE#gid=0

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http://www.wrxtuners.com/forums/f121/2011-wrx-build-31226/
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