The time finally came...motor build! - Page 3 - Subaru WRX Forum
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post #31 of 61 Old 09-01-2011, 09:20 PM
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Eh...The runaway builder Ron Williams (Not his real name supposedly) told me that Spec 0 bearings are the same as Race bearings. I'm not sure which acl bearings were used though. Sigh...maybe I'll get lucky. Just can't run myself out of oil this time. Spec 0 bearings were on my Ron engine.

Well. The Nitrite is supposed to reduce the friction on the crank and make it stronger. From what Basco on this forum told me.

I might get lucky too and Chad's builder might've just stuck to OEMs or went with another brand bearing.

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post #32 of 61 Old 09-02-2011, 03:08 PM Thread Starter
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OEM or, like in my case, Clevite. I have had luck with both. Cosworth simply coats the ACL bearings, and I believe they use the ACL H race bearings..
What do you mean by they coat the bearings?

I know I had said i'm using the OEM bearings but that was a typo. I actually went ahead and ordered the Cosworth bearings but am all concerned now as I don't want them to go bad as I absolutely will not have the money to pull my engine again. My build as it sits is $$$ and I'd do it myself but I don't have the proper tools/workspace/time to do it. I'm trying to save some money here and there with parts but if buying the Cosworth main and rod bearings are going to FML in the end then I'll just spend the extra $ on getting the OEM.

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post #33 of 61 Old 09-02-2011, 03:13 PM Thread Starter
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Eh...The runaway builder Ron Williams (Not his real name supposedly) told me that Spec 0 bearings are the same as Race bearings. I'm not sure which acl bearings were used though. Sigh...maybe I'll get lucky. Just can't run myself out of oil this time. Spec 0 bearings were on my Ron engine.

Well. The Nitrite is supposed to reduce the friction on the crank and make it stronger. From what Basco on this forum told me.

I might get lucky too and Chad's builder might've just stuck to OEMs or went with another brand bearing.
Kirt what all did you have done on your previous build and how many miles did you have it before you lost all your oil? Also what's your driving style like. I just want to get a better feel about these ACL bearings.

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post #34 of 61 Old 09-02-2011, 03:44 PM
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By coating the bearings I mean they use a special anti-friction coating. Although I will add that the coating does add to the over all clearances so keep that in mind when measuring things out.

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post #35 of 61 Old 09-02-2011, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by turmic View Post
Eh...The runaway builder Ron Williams (Not his real name supposedly) told me that Spec 0 bearings are the same as Race bearings. I'm not sure which acl bearings were used though. Sigh...maybe I'll get lucky. Just can't run myself out of oil this time. Spec 0 bearings were on my Ron engine.

Well. The Nitrite is supposed to reduce the friction on the crank and make it stronger. From what Basco on this forum told me.

I might get lucky too and Chad's builder might've just stuck to OEMs or went with another brand bearing.
Hmmm my reply to this post got erased....Hope I didn't offend someone. Anyway I guess I was wrong and the nitrite process weakens the inner metal and may cause the crank to snap...I guess Turn In Concepts had one snap on them.

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post #36 of 61 Old 09-02-2011, 11:10 PM
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Keith: Then explain this to me and why everyone says its hardening the crank when you nitride it. I think TIC just had a pos crank if it was nitrided and cracked.

Manley Subaru EJ20/EJ25 Crankshaft - Automotosports, Inc.

Brett: I swapped motors at 61K miles. It probably lasted 13K more miles in a little over a year. Granted...it ran completly out of oil and then ran for about another 300+ miles until the two bearings let go. It seemed like the two on the drivers side were the ones to fail...probably because the drain plug is on that side. I'm not on the car all the time...but since I started taking the work vehicle home. I started to get on it more when I actually was driving the STI. I mean I've pulled out on on-ramps behind people that have came to a full stop and was doing 70+ in about 4-5 seconds a couple times. People where I live are stupid when it comes to merging on the highway. So, its not like I babied the engine. I'm thinking I am probably fine unless I get a lemon pair of bearings or do something stupid like run the car out of oil again. I think my bearings were already worn when I just had to floor it to show a EVO 8 that I could out run him going to another rally stage. That's when the knock kicked in. LOL, I should've just kept babying it until I got home. But, then again....I never should've kept driving it after running it out of oil.

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post #37 of 61 Old 09-03-2011, 06:23 AM
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Keith: Then explain this to me and why everyone says its hardening the crank when you nitride it. I think TIC just had a pos crank if it was nitrided and cracked.

Manley Subaru EJ20/EJ25 Crankshaft - Automotosports, Inc.

Brett: I swapped motors at 61K miles. It probably lasted 13K more miles in a little over a year. Granted...it ran completly out of oil and then ran for about another 300+ miles until the two bearings let go. It seemed like the two on the drivers side were the ones to fail...probably because the drain plug is on that side. I'm not on the car all the time...but since I started taking the work vehicle home. I started to get on it more when I actually was driving the STI. I mean I've pulled out on on-ramps behind people that have came to a full stop and was doing 70+ in about 4-5 seconds a couple times. People where I live are stupid when it comes to merging on the highway. So, its not like I babied the engine. I'm thinking I am probably fine unless I get a lemon pair of bearings or do something stupid like run the car out of oil again. I think my bearings were already worn when I just had to floor it to show a EVO 8 that I could out run him going to another rally stage. That's when the knock kicked in. LOL, I should've just kept babying it until I got home. But, then again....I never should've kept driving it after running it out of oil.
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post #38 of 61 Old 09-03-2011, 09:24 PM
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NASIOC - View Single Post - Strength of Nitrited oe crank

This makes more sense...seeing as how the bearings were the reason everyone was having the engine problems originally. Zinc isn't bad for the environment or AMSoil wouldn't have just came out with a high Zinc oil. Lead is bad for the environment though.

SOA is stupid...but not so stupid to keep doing what was breaking in the first place. Look at the bearing failures and how they owned up to it.

Edit: Nasioc isn't a reliable place for all of its information anyway. Can anyone remember how KillerB motorsports used it for publicity and a sales base on its oil pick up tube? People that have worked on Subarus for years never heard of or had a oil pick up tube ever fail. Yet that thread made it sound like the sky was falling and you had to order one of kiss your engine good bye. Ron the run a way builder who worked on all sorts of subaru engines for years said he never had a oil pick up tube failure or heard of one. Unless someone physically damaged it.

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post #39 of 61 Old 09-03-2011, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by turmic View Post
NASIOC - View Single Post - Strength of Nitrited oe crank

This makes more sense...seeing as how the bearings were the reason everyone was having the engine problems originally. Zinc isn't bad for the environment or AMSoil wouldn't have just came out with a high Zinc oil. Lead is bad for the environment though.

SOA is stupid...but not so stupid to keep doing what was breaking in the first place. Look at the bearing failures and how they owned up to it.

Edit: Nasioc isn't a reliable place for all of its information anyway. Can anyone remember how KillerB motorsports used it for publicity and a sales base on its oil pick up tube? People that have worked on Subarus for years never heard of or had a oil pick up tube ever fail. Yet that thread made it sound like the sky was falling and you had to order one of kiss your engine good bye. Ron the run a way builder who worked on all sorts of subaru engines for years said he never had a oil pick up tube failure or heard of one. Unless someone physically damaged it.
Under normal circumstances I'd agree, but I spoke with Micha(Homemade WRX) on there about it a little further and he told me that he is starting to hear of more people having the same issues. I'm not saying that everything is correct there, but again Micha knows is stuff and he and I have spoken on many occasions about these very things.
Also the whole pickup tube thing, I am still running the factory one without issue so meh....

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post #40 of 61 Old 09-03-2011, 11:36 PM
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I asked all sorts of people in the industry and they pretty much said they never heard of a oil pick up tube failure. Back when that post first came out.

If the nitrided cranks are failing because of the nitride I would suspect our forums would get a few hits of failures. Our forum got a ton of bearing failures back when that problem was prevalent. We have more than a few people running a decent amout of power through their 08+ wrxs. Hondafan had bad piston rings on his 08 STI....which is still MIA unless its fixed and he hasn't updated us lately. But, I haven't heard of a bad crank yet.

Hmm....well, if we start getting hits for crank failures you can say I told you so. Until then...stop all the bad juju on my new engine. Supposedly the ACL bearings are going to fail and the crank will split down the middle like a hot dog. God...I just want a engine to last.

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post #41 of 61 Old 09-04-2011, 07:08 AM
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Well the reason the bearings were failing was because the newer nitride cranks surface was to hard for the old style bearings that they were using, so they switched to the newer bearings to fix the problem. Again i'm not trying to post bad info or pass on bad juju to you, but you should have all the info at hand like everyone else Kirt.

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post #42 of 61 Old 09-04-2011, 06:41 PM
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I know...but how many cranks did TIC blow up? It seems more like a isolated incident at this point. Beyond the other poster that blew up his JDM EJ207 crank in that post and some guy that likes to drop his crank on the flat side to see what kind of pitch fork noise comes out of it. I don't know why he'd do that and then say he has broken two cranks so far.

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post #43 of 61 Old 09-04-2011, 06:59 PM
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I know...but how many cranks did TIC blow up? It seems more like a isolated incident at this point. Beyond the other poster that blew up his JDM EJ207 crank in that post and some guy that likes to drop his crank on the flat side to see what kind of pitch fork noise comes out of it. I don't know why he'd do that and then say he has broken two cranks so far.
That's actually an old hot rodder trick, but your suppose to tap it with a hammer. Meh again I am just trying to give you all the info I have heard and make sure you are aware of it. TiC has broken at least 2 that I know of. I think you'll be fine, beside if you blow this motor I will have a spare...

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post #44 of 61 Old 09-04-2011, 11:40 PM
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Oh, just to be clear. I'm not calling you a lier, I'm just making sure its not blown out of proportion before its a actual epidemic. Thank you for the insight. If this engine blows up I'm going to flip out; unless it lasts quite a while. Its just stressful to hear that I'm using parts that may or may not last. Up until this thread...I thought it was pretty rock solid. But, my builder might be pretty meticulous and my stuff might last longer than the average bear.

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post #45 of 61 Old 09-05-2011, 07:23 AM
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Pmed you...

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